at the risk of sounding like a super obnoxious fan of your work, I feel like I need to an express such a loud thank you for helping me, and other people to better understand what the heck has been occurring with the cult like followers of that obviously very sick individual and writing about it under the summary the "contagion" has been so crucial in referencing what has happened in regards to everything having to do with the cretin and his family who have clearly been part of the mass manipulation. I've often wondered what else would be learned if Ivanka was able to speak freely. Anyways , thanks again for shedding such light onto so much of this madness, it really does help immensely in being able to actually process the recent past and everything that has and is occurring as a result and in association with that cretin who has been stinking up the collective unconscious. ty.
Here is another excellent statement from Dr. Lee. Some people, in addition to those who study cults like Steven Hassan, are beginning to realize the contagion happening. I've heard more people using the word "cult," but then there's always some intellectual swinging the pendulum back the other way by taking issue with it. The Cult of Trump Personality (CTP, as I've put it) isn't totally widespread--actually remaining in the weird non-majority (see the presidential election popular vote in both 2016 and 2020). However, it's big enough and being empowered, as sensed by the blindly following members, by Trump and his enablers. One thing that persons who still deny "cult" get accurate is that it's very important for the genuine majority to *vote* accordingly (non-Republican or the CTP party). It's to help in a big way to make whatever the phenomenon is called eventually go away.
There's a book by Barbara F Walter - "How Civil Wars Start" which paints a bleak picture of America. But i don't think situation is this bad. There are many positives & some negatives. The biggest positive is that American population on aggregate scale is still not radicalized - meaning it's still civilized & want to stay civilized. The problem in America is still very manageable if it's dealt swiftly & urgently. The MAGA base is like 20% of population & most of them are not radicalized enough to the point of violence. But big negative is that MAGA problem is not being dealt with urgency. It's like a cancer in early phase where it can be removed but it's getting ignored & prolonged allowing it to spread.
What i am seeing in America is what we have seen in India 30-35 years ago. The Pathocratic leaders were is small minority - these Fascists were small in number but our State was weak & continued to ignore their illegalities. They could've been easily crushed but they were allowed to grow. When they gathered sufficient strength, they confronted weak liberal ruling govt. They launched pogroms, riots, mass killings etc (90s pogroms & Rath Yatras of India). With every crime, they got emboldened. Finally when weak liberal regime tried to confront them - they threatened civil war. The majority of radicalized Hindu militias threatened ethnic cleansing of India. The liberal regime got scared & backed down. This was turning point in India's political history & just in few years they consolidated political power & wiped out opposition.
One core characteristic of pathocratic leaders is that they don't have any restraints, with every crime they get more unstable & emboldened. Only way to control & neutralize such leaders is enforcing strict outside restraints on these leaders. Trump crimes are well known. But AG Garland delayed his prosecution for 18 months. Now he daily violates his bail terms by attacking judges, DAs, courts, threatening witnesses etc etc. He calls for more violence & civil war. But American courts are not holding him in contempt. This prolonging of his illegal behavior only emboldens him & his gang.
This month Trump will be participating in GOP primary debates where he's already a leading candidate by far. He's now normalized as a face of Prez candidate. A man who incited insurrection is now again contending for power - malignant normality. So far MAGA is weak, it is threatening civil war but they don't have power to start anything. I do not think American society is fragmented to the point of civil war but Trump will never allow healing of America. He will radicalize America more & more every day. Everyday Trump is not in solitary confinement, he's busy gaslighting America. Destroy Trump swiftly as soon as possible - there won't be any civil war. No one will miss this scoundrel. But prolong this cancer for another year, it will be a different picture.
Thank you. It’s important to look at past histories, especially of other nations that have experienced similar situations, and see how it all played out. I believe there is hope for our nation since the majority are waking up to the danger of “trumpism” and are ready to fight against it at the ballot box.
Allowing Fascist political parties to reach Ballot Box has always been the gravest mistake. Fascist forces are incompatible with Democracy and should never be allowed to participate in Democracy. Fascism by design is Kryptonite of Democracy. You need militant Democracy (Karl Loewenstien) to destroy MAGA & Trumpism.
I'll look him up. I'd just take issue about the voting. People still have the right to vote if they are eligible. The key is to have that majority outvote them--I hope!
People have right to vote but Fascist political parties don't have right to participate in political process. See reconstruction of Europe after WW2 after great tragedy. Fascist party in Italy is banned by constitution. Similarly Nazi party banned after fall of 3rd Reich and Nazi symbols/slogans also banned. Presently in Germany, there's a debate about banning extreme right AfD party which is a threat to Democracy. The idea is that political parties that are a threat to Democracy itself should not be allowed to participate in Democracy.
Joseph Goebbels: "It will always remain one of democracy's best jokes that it provided its deadly enemies with the means by which it was destroyed."
Democracy is a political system which has to safeguarded with certain set of mechanisms. Democracy is not just about elections & voting or right to vote. It's much more sophisticated than that. In our country, India, people have right to vote and they freely choose to vote for Fascist dictator Modi. Russia also has elections and voting where people vote for dictator Putin. Same thing for Islamofascist Erdogan in Turkey. These dictators & Fascists are winning elections for decades & ruining their countries because their Democratic system has failed.
It's another fallacy that "majority voters" make rational decisions. Majority voters can take highly irrational decisions and even commit collective suicide.
Thank you. Yours is an excellent balanced view of the situation. Ruthlessness pays off in the short run with people who will stop at nothing until stopped. Oftentimes, if there's a delay, there can indeed be tragedy. The legal system itself is kind of on trial here. There is a definite difference between rich, white males and the rest of the population regarding justice--not just the law. Money rules, as ever, but it still isn't too late--Garland, et al., are seemingly catching up (though the wheels of justice turn very slowly anyway). Moreover, you (and others) make a very good point about the radical Right being not in a majority, though it's still up to determined leaders and a voting majority to cut out this cancer. Anyway, I take heart in reading messages from people who understand the situation, seeing us as among that majority. Sometimes, "confirmation bias" is about confirming something accurate and true!
Extreme right wing are small minority. MAGA is less than 20% of population. The problem is their fanaticism. A highly motivated group can wield greater power over a much larger group. MAGA fanatics are highly motivated (for very wrong reasons) and Trump is radicalizing them to destroy political opponents and Democracy itself - culmination is Jan 6 riot. MAGA doesn't care about Democracy anymore (they have become delusional that 2020 elections were stolen) , they give their allegiance to Trump.
The best way to smash MAGA is destroy their leadership Trump. Take down Trump & his gang with full force of Justice & put him into the grinder. Shatter his myth of invincibility and omnipotence. MAGA will fall. But prolonging & delaying Trump prosecution, ignoring his brazen crimes and overlooking his dangerousness will galvanize MAGA everyday, until the day it gather sufficient strength to win back power.
What you are saying is what I feel and see. It is very concerning. Thank you for explaining the "climate" to us. Please continue to offer suggestions as far as what to do about it. Thank you.
There is an extremely good analysis of the combination of political, social, psychological, and economic factors that create the foundation for the demagogue’s dissemination of mass psychosis in Chris Hedge’s current newsletter, “Our Collective Trauma is the Road to Tyranny.”
Though Dr. Lee and Chris Hedges have (inevitably) been marginalized in current public discourse, we are extremely fortunate that they are able to share their understanding with us.
As Ruth Ben-Ghiat writes in her book "Strongmen": “Individual actions designed to be seen by the public break through the screen of official media and offer models of resistance that can be transformative” (p. 195).
"However, this “Trump Contagion” of which I speak is actually a more nuanced and complicated subject that pushes the boundaries of the psychological disciplines"
The above statement by Dr. Lee puts into serious question her own field of psychiatry. How is it possible that Trump's behavior has not been condemned as you think it should? How much longer must we put up with his sick twisted behavior while at the same time millions of people worship him as an object of idolatry? It's collectively accepted that we have zero tolerance for bullies, rapist, killers, and sexual predators, but what about demagogues? To make matters worse, we put such individuals at the highest levels of political power! This says as much about demagogues as it does about those who worship them i.e. those who fail to see Trump for who he really is. Our psychiatrists, psychologists, and social scientists have a serious problem in their hands in that their knowledge of human behavior is not up to the task in addressing the immediacy of our most pressing problems.
In Steven James Bartlett's book "Normality Does Not Equal Mental Health: The Need to Look Elsewhere for Standards of Good Psychological Health" he said,
"Central to human pathology is human resistance to an awareness of it. "Denial" would be an understatement, for the forces that stand in the way of humankind's reflective consciousness of the psychological and ecological logical malignancy of the species are incredibly strong, tenacious, and self-preserving. As a result of human recalcitrance to acknowledge our own pathology, in the history of behavioral science, and in particular in the history of psychology and psychiatry, almost no effort has been made to gain an understanding standing of human pathology that has its roots in normal--as opposed to abnormal psychology. Primarily among psychiatrists there have been a few notable exceptions, including Menninger, Fromm, Peck, Milton Erickson, and others whose observations are discussed in Bartlett (2005), all of whom have had the courage to recognize the pathological constitution of the ordinary person who so often is a willing participant in inflicting suffering, death, and destruction. But despite the work of these few researchers, psychology and psychiatry have doggedly reserved the term `pathology' exclusively for application to individuals and groups judged to be abnormal, that is, whose psychology deviates from the norm. This, as Bartlett (2005) attempts to show, is short-sightedness in the extreme"
You may appreciate the psychologist Paul Friday and his "Friday's Laws." fridayslaws.com From reading your comment, I'm reminded of Dr. Friday's definition of normal: "Everybody has crazy thoughts, but normal people know it sooner" (referring to the denial factor). Another psychologist who's done 30+ years of research on authoritarian followers is Dr. Robert Altemeyer. Free reading is on theauthoritarians.org. His latest statement is on its home page: "Why Do So Many People Still Support Donald Trump?" Bob Altemeyer, May 2023
*VOTE* for candidates with integrity and for the common good (that is, non-Republican). Supporting such candidates in their campaigns would be added, worthwhile effort.
I see your point, especially about situations like in Germany just before and after the Nazis and about some irrational voters in the U.S. However, also in the U.S., there is still hope for a sensible majority, like the majority popular vote for the presidential candidates against Trump in *both* 2016 and 2020. And about political parties, here is what "Bard" answers:
The U.S. Constitution does not prohibit certain kinds of political parties because they are dangerously unconstitutional. In fact, the Constitution does not mention political parties at all. The First Amendment to the Constitution protects the right of association, which includes the right to form and join political parties. This means that the government cannot ban a political party, even if it believes that the party's goals are dangerous or unconstitutional.
However, the government can regulate the activities of political parties. For example, the government can require political parties to register with the government, and it can set rules for how political parties conduct their primaries and elections. The government can also investigate and prosecute political parties for violations of the law.
In addition, the government can indirectly limit the activities of political parties by passing laws that make it more difficult for them to raise money or get their message out. For example, the government can regulate campaign finance or impose restrictions on political advertising.
However, the government cannot ban a political party simply because it disagrees with the party's views. This would violate the First Amendment right to free speech and association.
The only way that a political party could be banned in the United States is if it were found to be a threat to the national security or the existence of the government itself. However, this would be a very high bar to meet, and it is unlikely that any political party would ever be banned under these circumstances.
at the risk of sounding like a super obnoxious fan of your work, I feel like I need to an express such a loud thank you for helping me, and other people to better understand what the heck has been occurring with the cult like followers of that obviously very sick individual and writing about it under the summary the "contagion" has been so crucial in referencing what has happened in regards to everything having to do with the cretin and his family who have clearly been part of the mass manipulation. I've often wondered what else would be learned if Ivanka was able to speak freely. Anyways , thanks again for shedding such light onto so much of this madness, it really does help immensely in being able to actually process the recent past and everything that has and is occurring as a result and in association with that cretin who has been stinking up the collective unconscious. ty.
Here is another excellent statement from Dr. Lee. Some people, in addition to those who study cults like Steven Hassan, are beginning to realize the contagion happening. I've heard more people using the word "cult," but then there's always some intellectual swinging the pendulum back the other way by taking issue with it. The Cult of Trump Personality (CTP, as I've put it) isn't totally widespread--actually remaining in the weird non-majority (see the presidential election popular vote in both 2016 and 2020). However, it's big enough and being empowered, as sensed by the blindly following members, by Trump and his enablers. One thing that persons who still deny "cult" get accurate is that it's very important for the genuine majority to *vote* accordingly (non-Republican or the CTP party). It's to help in a big way to make whatever the phenomenon is called eventually go away.
Dr Lee,
There's a book by Barbara F Walter - "How Civil Wars Start" which paints a bleak picture of America. But i don't think situation is this bad. There are many positives & some negatives. The biggest positive is that American population on aggregate scale is still not radicalized - meaning it's still civilized & want to stay civilized. The problem in America is still very manageable if it's dealt swiftly & urgently. The MAGA base is like 20% of population & most of them are not radicalized enough to the point of violence. But big negative is that MAGA problem is not being dealt with urgency. It's like a cancer in early phase where it can be removed but it's getting ignored & prolonged allowing it to spread.
What i am seeing in America is what we have seen in India 30-35 years ago. The Pathocratic leaders were is small minority - these Fascists were small in number but our State was weak & continued to ignore their illegalities. They could've been easily crushed but they were allowed to grow. When they gathered sufficient strength, they confronted weak liberal ruling govt. They launched pogroms, riots, mass killings etc (90s pogroms & Rath Yatras of India). With every crime, they got emboldened. Finally when weak liberal regime tried to confront them - they threatened civil war. The majority of radicalized Hindu militias threatened ethnic cleansing of India. The liberal regime got scared & backed down. This was turning point in India's political history & just in few years they consolidated political power & wiped out opposition.
One core characteristic of pathocratic leaders is that they don't have any restraints, with every crime they get more unstable & emboldened. Only way to control & neutralize such leaders is enforcing strict outside restraints on these leaders. Trump crimes are well known. But AG Garland delayed his prosecution for 18 months. Now he daily violates his bail terms by attacking judges, DAs, courts, threatening witnesses etc etc. He calls for more violence & civil war. But American courts are not holding him in contempt. This prolonging of his illegal behavior only emboldens him & his gang.
This month Trump will be participating in GOP primary debates where he's already a leading candidate by far. He's now normalized as a face of Prez candidate. A man who incited insurrection is now again contending for power - malignant normality. So far MAGA is weak, it is threatening civil war but they don't have power to start anything. I do not think American society is fragmented to the point of civil war but Trump will never allow healing of America. He will radicalize America more & more every day. Everyday Trump is not in solitary confinement, he's busy gaslighting America. Destroy Trump swiftly as soon as possible - there won't be any civil war. No one will miss this scoundrel. But prolong this cancer for another year, it will be a different picture.
Thank you. It’s important to look at past histories, especially of other nations that have experienced similar situations, and see how it all played out. I believe there is hope for our nation since the majority are waking up to the danger of “trumpism” and are ready to fight against it at the ballot box.
Allowing Fascist political parties to reach Ballot Box has always been the gravest mistake. Fascist forces are incompatible with Democracy and should never be allowed to participate in Democracy. Fascism by design is Kryptonite of Democracy. You need militant Democracy (Karl Loewenstien) to destroy MAGA & Trumpism.
I'll look him up. I'd just take issue about the voting. People still have the right to vote if they are eligible. The key is to have that majority outvote them--I hope!
People have right to vote but Fascist political parties don't have right to participate in political process. See reconstruction of Europe after WW2 after great tragedy. Fascist party in Italy is banned by constitution. Similarly Nazi party banned after fall of 3rd Reich and Nazi symbols/slogans also banned. Presently in Germany, there's a debate about banning extreme right AfD party which is a threat to Democracy. The idea is that political parties that are a threat to Democracy itself should not be allowed to participate in Democracy.
Joseph Goebbels: "It will always remain one of democracy's best jokes that it provided its deadly enemies with the means by which it was destroyed."
Democracy is a political system which has to safeguarded with certain set of mechanisms. Democracy is not just about elections & voting or right to vote. It's much more sophisticated than that. In our country, India, people have right to vote and they freely choose to vote for Fascist dictator Modi. Russia also has elections and voting where people vote for dictator Putin. Same thing for Islamofascist Erdogan in Turkey. These dictators & Fascists are winning elections for decades & ruining their countries because their Democratic system has failed.
It's another fallacy that "majority voters" make rational decisions. Majority voters can take highly irrational decisions and even commit collective suicide.
Thank you. Yours is an excellent balanced view of the situation. Ruthlessness pays off in the short run with people who will stop at nothing until stopped. Oftentimes, if there's a delay, there can indeed be tragedy. The legal system itself is kind of on trial here. There is a definite difference between rich, white males and the rest of the population regarding justice--not just the law. Money rules, as ever, but it still isn't too late--Garland, et al., are seemingly catching up (though the wheels of justice turn very slowly anyway). Moreover, you (and others) make a very good point about the radical Right being not in a majority, though it's still up to determined leaders and a voting majority to cut out this cancer. Anyway, I take heart in reading messages from people who understand the situation, seeing us as among that majority. Sometimes, "confirmation bias" is about confirming something accurate and true!
Extreme right wing are small minority. MAGA is less than 20% of population. The problem is their fanaticism. A highly motivated group can wield greater power over a much larger group. MAGA fanatics are highly motivated (for very wrong reasons) and Trump is radicalizing them to destroy political opponents and Democracy itself - culmination is Jan 6 riot. MAGA doesn't care about Democracy anymore (they have become delusional that 2020 elections were stolen) , they give their allegiance to Trump.
The best way to smash MAGA is destroy their leadership Trump. Take down Trump & his gang with full force of Justice & put him into the grinder. Shatter his myth of invincibility and omnipotence. MAGA will fall. But prolonging & delaying Trump prosecution, ignoring his brazen crimes and overlooking his dangerousness will galvanize MAGA everyday, until the day it gather sufficient strength to win back power.
What you are saying is what I feel and see. It is very concerning. Thank you for explaining the "climate" to us. Please continue to offer suggestions as far as what to do about it. Thank you.
There is an extremely good analysis of the combination of political, social, psychological, and economic factors that create the foundation for the demagogue’s dissemination of mass psychosis in Chris Hedge’s current newsletter, “Our Collective Trauma is the Road to Tyranny.”
Though Dr. Lee and Chris Hedges have (inevitably) been marginalized in current public discourse, we are extremely fortunate that they are able to share their understanding with us.
As Ruth Ben-Ghiat writes in her book "Strongmen": “Individual actions designed to be seen by the public break through the screen of official media and offer models of resistance that can be transformative” (p. 195).
"However, this “Trump Contagion” of which I speak is actually a more nuanced and complicated subject that pushes the boundaries of the psychological disciplines"
The above statement by Dr. Lee puts into serious question her own field of psychiatry. How is it possible that Trump's behavior has not been condemned as you think it should? How much longer must we put up with his sick twisted behavior while at the same time millions of people worship him as an object of idolatry? It's collectively accepted that we have zero tolerance for bullies, rapist, killers, and sexual predators, but what about demagogues? To make matters worse, we put such individuals at the highest levels of political power! This says as much about demagogues as it does about those who worship them i.e. those who fail to see Trump for who he really is. Our psychiatrists, psychologists, and social scientists have a serious problem in their hands in that their knowledge of human behavior is not up to the task in addressing the immediacy of our most pressing problems.
In Steven James Bartlett's book "Normality Does Not Equal Mental Health: The Need to Look Elsewhere for Standards of Good Psychological Health" he said,
"Central to human pathology is human resistance to an awareness of it. "Denial" would be an understatement, for the forces that stand in the way of humankind's reflective consciousness of the psychological and ecological logical malignancy of the species are incredibly strong, tenacious, and self-preserving. As a result of human recalcitrance to acknowledge our own pathology, in the history of behavioral science, and in particular in the history of psychology and psychiatry, almost no effort has been made to gain an understanding standing of human pathology that has its roots in normal--as opposed to abnormal psychology. Primarily among psychiatrists there have been a few notable exceptions, including Menninger, Fromm, Peck, Milton Erickson, and others whose observations are discussed in Bartlett (2005), all of whom have had the courage to recognize the pathological constitution of the ordinary person who so often is a willing participant in inflicting suffering, death, and destruction. But despite the work of these few researchers, psychology and psychiatry have doggedly reserved the term `pathology' exclusively for application to individuals and groups judged to be abnormal, that is, whose psychology deviates from the norm. This, as Bartlett (2005) attempts to show, is short-sightedness in the extreme"
You may appreciate the psychologist Paul Friday and his "Friday's Laws." fridayslaws.com From reading your comment, I'm reminded of Dr. Friday's definition of normal: "Everybody has crazy thoughts, but normal people know it sooner" (referring to the denial factor). Another psychologist who's done 30+ years of research on authoritarian followers is Dr. Robert Altemeyer. Free reading is on theauthoritarians.org. His latest statement is on its home page: "Why Do So Many People Still Support Donald Trump?" Bob Altemeyer, May 2023
So, what can we do within our own households to stop contagion?
*VOTE* for candidates with integrity and for the common good (that is, non-Republican). Supporting such candidates in their campaigns would be added, worthwhile effort.
I see your point, especially about situations like in Germany just before and after the Nazis and about some irrational voters in the U.S. However, also in the U.S., there is still hope for a sensible majority, like the majority popular vote for the presidential candidates against Trump in *both* 2016 and 2020. And about political parties, here is what "Bard" answers:
The U.S. Constitution does not prohibit certain kinds of political parties because they are dangerously unconstitutional. In fact, the Constitution does not mention political parties at all. The First Amendment to the Constitution protects the right of association, which includes the right to form and join political parties. This means that the government cannot ban a political party, even if it believes that the party's goals are dangerous or unconstitutional.
However, the government can regulate the activities of political parties. For example, the government can require political parties to register with the government, and it can set rules for how political parties conduct their primaries and elections. The government can also investigate and prosecute political parties for violations of the law.
In addition, the government can indirectly limit the activities of political parties by passing laws that make it more difficult for them to raise money or get their message out. For example, the government can regulate campaign finance or impose restrictions on political advertising.
However, the government cannot ban a political party simply because it disagrees with the party's views. This would violate the First Amendment right to free speech and association.
The only way that a political party could be banned in the United States is if it were found to be a threat to the national security or the existence of the government itself. However, this would be a very high bar to meet, and it is unlikely that any political party would ever be banned under these circumstances.