Bandy, the decision on the part of 4-Star Generals John Kelly and Mark Milley NOT to go public with their well-founded fears about the dangerousness of Donald Trump, might also reflect how little most of us know regarding how to deal with a volatile, delusional, malevolent sociopath, especially one with the power of the presidency. I wish they'd consulted you directly when they first had serious concerns.
However, it might be helpful, even now, to produce a document with directions similar to those we'd give to someone who has concerns that a family member is "a danger to himself or others." We spoke about creating such a document years ago and I remember researching the laws in D.C. regarding 72hr. holds, and other ideas such as the use of the 25th Amendment.
I'm glad this material has finally been made public but I understand your colleague's disappointment and anger that Milly and Kelly remained silent for so long. I also agree that the restraints the APA exerted over media consulting with mental health experts is one of the real reasons that the gaslighting of America has lasted clear up until only weeks before the election. Thank heaven we've finally reached this tipping point and let's hope it's in the nick of time.
Thank you, Dr Taylor. Great points, in particular the one about not *knowing how to handle troubled, troubling, troublesome personalities. The Generals were navigating in uncharted, extremely turbulent waters. Enough to make almost anyone nervous and reticent.
I think in the course of more typical cases there are ways to intercede or treat people who become disorganized, threatening, violent, etc. You can get restraining orders, you can get them hospitalized, you can call the police, you can work with an HR department to get them fired, you can have a family intervention, etc. NONE of those tools are available for the President of the United States.
I share some exasperation that Kelly and Milley delayed. But they have also both leaked powerful information about Trump, e. g., Kelley let it out about Trump calling dead veterans "losers and" suckers" and I think had even touched on some of the Hitler/German generals material; Milley had been confrontational about the Lafayette Park incident, and he had talked to Woodward for the previous book about Jan 6 and calling his Chinese counterpart to reassure him. These two have been restrained but not silent.
And how long did Woodward wait to publish the information? He did the same thing in the 2020 book where he did not disclose Trump's dishonesty about Covid FOR MONTHS as he would have scooped himself on his own book. How about Woodward's ethics?
Have some perspective. This problem is way beyond Kelly and Milley. They can't convene a meeting to discuss the 25th Amendment. That has to come from the VP. Pence was pressured to bring the cabinet together after Jan 6 but refused to do so. That was the time to do it. Plus the Senate, with McConnell's insidious influence, did not convict Trump. Only 7 Republicans voted to convict. Another major and more pointed failure. He would have been finished and unable to run again.
Blame Kevin McCarthy. Blame Mike Meadows. Blame Fox. Blame Hawley and Cruz. Blame NYT and WSJ. Blame Rona Romney. Blame Steve Bannon. Blame John Roberts. Blame Samuel Alito. Blame Jinny Thomas. Blame Matt Goetz and MTG. Blame the Heritage Foundation. Blame Lindsay Grahame and Tom Cotton. Blame all the gaslighters in the MAGA cult. Blame 75 million Americans who will vote for Fascism in 10 days. There is plenty of blame to go around. Where is George W Bush? Where is Mitt Romney? Paul Ryan? John Boehner?
What Kelly and Milley said lasted one news cycle. It sold some newspapers and some books for Woodward. Today there were 30 more ghastly things Trump did and there will be 30 tomorrow. It's like trying to catch all the raindrops with a teacup.
It's way beyond Kelly and Milley to have stopped it. If 3,000 votes change because of it, well then it helped.
"Where is George W Bush? Where is Mitt Romney? Paul Ryan? John Boehner?" lmportant questions to this erstwhile Republican (i.e., me). Sure wish candidate Trump could have been subject to a Court Martial proceeding as the Commander-in-Chief.
That would have been a nice chess move, Ned! Trump's dishonor towards the military is epic in proportion. I can't understand how any Vet or anyone in their sphere or anyone who respects our military could Vote MAGA. Not to mention the attitude towards police on Jan 6, or, gross worship of criminals/terrrorists convicted in wake of Jan 6. The latter will all get pardoned 1/20/25 if Trumpenstein is installed. It is so unpatriotic and horrible. You couldn't write this as a screenplay -- it would get rejected!! Better as screenplay than history, though...
Instead, he plans to Court Martial the honorable General Milley if, God forbid, he is elected. After that, General Milley's execution will take place. (We know that he will be found guilty. That's how fascism works, after all.)
Harrowing scenario but entirely possible. I don't know what institutional safeguards could prevent it via military tribunal. Or, as we now know, Trump could unilaterally assassinate foes as an official act and face no consequences -- and could pardon the hangman as well. The SCOMAGA, to its eternal shame, has paved the pathway to fascism. SCOMAGA is caught up in Trump contagion, as will be all institutions if Project 2025 becomes the law of the land. My sense is that by February 2025 it will be readily apparent to millions of Trump voters that he "meant what he said". Will they be horrified or jubilant? Dystopia looms...
Military leaders takes an oath to the Constitution, not to candidate Trump. That means they will, hopefully, belay any orders to prevent killings. At that point th would-be Mussolini will suffer the worst possible living end for people like him; that of being a cranky castratus.
"SCOMAGA". Wow! Precisely on target. Re military tribunals: since the orange sadist has already said that he only wants generals like the ones Hitler had, I don't think there will be any problem ordering an execution. And re the maga reaction to the election? Jubilant, at first. Not so much so, once starvation and fear (for those who realize their mistake and are stupid enough to say so aloud) become the coins of the new nation.
Blame Garland. Blame Atlanta DA who botched the easiest case against Trump.
Jan 6 committee was heroic. The witnesses were heroic. Capitol and DC police were heroic. Jack Smith was heroic. Judge Merchan was heroic. Judge in other NY case was heroic. Justices Kagan, Sotomayor, and Jackson were heroic. Dr Lee and associates were heroic. Ruth Ben-Ghiat has been heroic as have been Jason Stanley and Tim Snyder and Lawrence Tribe. Joe Biden and Kamala Harris have been heroic. The crew of Never Trumpers (so many) have been awesomely heroic. Liz Cheney and Adam K. have been absolutely heroic. Let's hope 85 or 90 million American voters, especially groups of 10,000 in 5 or 6 swing states will be heroic.
Superb comment about where the blame belongs. (Re Mitt Romney, he continues to pay $5,000/day -- as he has since Jan. 6th -- for security for his family and himself. And that doesn't count the terrible psychological stress they have all experienced. I think he did his part when he could. He's been paying a very high price, ever since.)
Thanks :) I agree that Romney is an equivocal figure, heroic at some moments, invisible at others. He stood up in Impeachment #1 for the first count -- but not the second count (improperly refusing to provide documents/records for Congressional oversight subpoena). He was there the 2nd time, too. He spoke out in his book. Certainly, he has paid a price financially and in terms of safety, for himself and his family. I wonder, though, why not come out all the more strongly in that case? What has he to lose at that point? What is the horror that he, his wife, his children, his grandchildren have to live with now? That story could move people. And he voted 90+++ per cent Republican while in the Senate, so what is that about? He has been brave but also way too constrained, in my opinion. I thought his oratory around the impeachments was brilliant and inspired, and should be included in anthologies of great American oratory, and be taught in schools as an example of courage in the face of corruption and tyranny. I wish him the best in his retirement from public life. I hope he does not wind up in a detention center with Generals Milley & Kelly, Joe Biden, Adam Kinzinger, Liz Cheney, Adam Schiff, Nancy Pelosi, Rachel Maddow, Joe & Mika, Bill Maher, Jimmie Kimmel, Mike Pence, Steve Schmidt, Stuart Stevens, Olivia Troye, Ric Wilson, Colin Kapernik (sp),and Taylor Swift, among others. All will be under threat. Madness!!!
"He has been brave but also way too constrained" Agree! "What has he to lose at that point?" For starters, his life? his wife and/or children's and/or grandchildren's lives? I agree, there are easily half a million people in our nation who face imprisonment or death because they dared to speak out. And that doesn't count the millions of "immigrants" (not counting his or his running mate's wives) who will face the same.
Yes, good point. I didn't mean to be flippant about it at all. It is a serious degree of danger for anyone who has spoken out. I believe the Heritage Foundation, et al., has been busy compiling their lists, and that will only accelerate. Did you listen to the podcast "Project 2025 Up Close and Personal"? It is 6 parts, and after the first one I was pretty shaken up, but I need to go back and listen to the rest of them. This touches on what you are alluding to: what could happen if it becomes real? The first one on immigration was terrifying. So the danger for Romney is real. Maybe if he shuts up he can get a pass...Or maybe there will be more Americans (in the right states) who did not fall prey to the contagion, who did not become "pod people" to fend off the horrors of Trump 2.0. Otherwise, the ascension of Vance to the presidency once Trump dies or gets removed by 25th Amendment -- a move that would be led by Vance-- will be assured. And then they will challenge the 22nd Amendment on presidential term limits, which SCOMAGA will give to them, and we will have Vance for....decades? Shudder to think how bad it could get and for how long...
Today's was a great session, Dr Taylor. My take? (Really, hope.) Vice President Harris will win the popular vote by five-to-seven percentage points and well over three hundred votes in the Electoral College. Let us not be discouraged. The trumper tantrums will bring out the base big-time in early voting; are jamming on the polling; and, tries to monopolize call-in shows. The rest of us will remain steadfast and vote candidate Trump not into the White House, but into jail.
Really good point. I try to put myself in the other fellow's shoes, but that exercise, while potentially wise, is purely hypothetical and shaped by my experiences and biasses.
Dr.Lee, I thank you wholeheartedly on behalf of my family and this nation for your continued warnings and shining light on the darkness.
As to the reluctance of major players... I have no proof. It seems increasingly likely the fascist/mob playbook has been in full activation against many. I have thought so since Robert Mueller's cryptic answers in front of congress. The Supreme Court Justice forced into retirement. Justice Ruth passing. Dirty McConnell sicker than a dog. His sister in law dead. Epstein and the missing evidence taken by Barr. People scared, compromised and dirty doing their best to protect family or what they have left.
Ultimately trying to protect their dirty kingdoms.
It's deep, dark, and dirty. We maybe know 10% of what went on. It will be 50 years before perhaps half is known. So much corruption, malfeasance, obstruction. Primordial slime creatures.
Thank you. I think it's a study in itself to look into the various reasons why very intelligent, accomplished, and not foolish people in service to this country would still associate themselves in any way with Trump. Evidently, a number of them have eventually discovered their mistake through direct experience. All it takes is a little study of that man's history and character to realize that he is toxic--to say the least. Foolish Trump supporters might rue the day of voting for him, but the consequences of that experience can take the rest of us down with it. "Experience keeps a dear [costly[ school, but a fool will learn in no other." (B. Franklin)
In my banking days in the late 1990s and the turn of the century, I assumed candidate Trump's "amazing" come-back came from laundering kleptocratically soiled soviet money; I was not alone among bankers in N.Y.C.
Milley and Kelly have both been in the military for many, many years. I have to wonder if they have (individually) anti-psychiatric disability mindsets... if they have "Real men don't cry" beliefs... if they believe "Real men handle their own problems in private... never admit they need to go to a 'shrink'." If this is true (and of course I have no such proof), those beliefs would have prevented them - even though they swore oaths to defend the Constitution - from publicly calling on Trump to get psychiatric treatment / possible removal from office using the 25th Amendment. Even if my guess is incorrect, I see their lack of action... and their unwillingness to appear at last month's event at the Washington Press Club ... as evidence they have psychological barriers to seeing the true disease we are dealing with here... evidence they are still not really "part of the solution" to ridding America of Trump Contagion. Just my 2 cents.
While I disagree with contemning Generals Kelly and and Milley as failing to be part of the solution, your thinking about the mind-set may hit the bull's eye. Steve, I suspect your 'thinking-out-writ' is, at least to some extent, accurate. Compounded by the two factors, identified below, an inward deterrent to outward declarations would be formidable, at least for me.
1st, Dr Taylor's thought on lay(wo)men often not knowing how to handle impaired souls; as well as,
2nd, K.D.'s observation about the security measures taken by various public servants to threats from the more vile M.A.G.A.s predisposed toward violence.
1st, both Gen. Milley and Gen. Kelly are career soldiers reliant upon a chain-of-command; breaking that chain is hard to do for (wo)men conditioned to it for thirty-plus years. 🪖
2nd, both Generals may have felt it presumptuous to speak out as they are not trained in psychiatry and psychology. 😳
3rd, discretion was the better part of valour, particularly in the case of General Milley; he could trust himself to honour his oath to the Constitution and belay orders, etc. Who knows what other Michael Flynns might be conniving away among the flag officers? 😰
4th, timing is everything, particularly for General Kelly. Had he called out candidate Trump's impairment in 2018, as he had implied to Congress(wo)men already (perhaps in the hope of an intervention by G.O.P. leadership to remove candidate Trump from the ticket in 2020), his revelation would have been old news by 2020 let alone 2024. Coming just prior to this year's election, the statements of these Generals should quiver, if not quite move, the needle. 💡
5th, it is hard to tell how close the country was, and is, to a civil conflict with fighting in the streets. Many militias and violent mal-contents are aligned with candidate Trump. Perhaps, Generals Kelly and Milley felt they were keeping a lid on a simmering cauldron in danger of boiling over into civil war. 🤞
I COMPLETELY agree with the assessment. They have failed in doing their duty to their country. MOreover, and I know I will get flack from this - I feel the same about Hutchinson and company. They all kept quiet, they all enabled him, until it became apparent that crimes were being committed and they could be considered complicit. I am glad they spoke up - but they still enable him in the big lie, and they still got their fat salaries. I admire Liz Cheney and Adam Kizinger.
I share your admiration for former Representatives Cheney and Kinzinger. On the other hand, the pressures of the positions working for an impaired chief executive would be immense. I suspect these aides figured that they could ride out candidate Trump's exit and preserve their careers.
The temptation of temporizing might well have been overwhelming for me; if not so inclined, I would have been fired and on the outside with no credibility to inform others.
Then came 06jan21.
Then there was no longer an enabling way for anyone of conscience to rationalize that event and candidate Trump's role in instigating the insurrection. Also, Ms Hutchinson should not be singled out; she was twenty-five and likely felt she could not affect anything.
Then came the 06jan21 investigating committee.
That gave her and some others the opportunity to speak up and be heard. I commend Ms Hutchinson's maturity and courage at so young an age.
I was thinking about something I read today: General Milley has had bullet-proof windows throughout his house. Trump is calling for his court martial and execution. Perhaps he is living in great fear, and probably not only for himself but also for his family members.
Yes, he continues to live in fear -- because he merely stood up and told the truth. Fascism has been alive and well for almost a decade in this country. This election will determine if it will be the hellscape of our future.
Really keen insight there, K.D.; threats to these officials are often implicitly or explicitly extended to their families. Being never-married, I have the option of being fatalistic in the face of such threats. What if I were married and had children, perhaps grand-children, and other loved ones attached to me? Well, endangering them by being 'brave' sure would make me think twice, thrice, seeking advice.
Thanks for your comment, Ned. As I read what you wrote, I found myself thinking about Mitt Romney. Since January 6, 2021, he has paid $5,000 PER DAY for security guards to protect him and his family. That's a WHOPPING $7,300,00 -- and it doesn't count the constant emotional stress he and his family members are under.
The professional Ego is the end of us. I call it the Night of Humanity, by which I don't mean the end of the species, but the depths we must go for truth and a love for truth.
The APA‘s invocation of the Goldwater rule would have been moot and ineffectual if it had not been rigorously enforced by the New York Times, which sets the agenda for the mainstream press. The New York Times is a major, essential instrument of the plutocracy, political oligarchy, and national security-state military-industrial complex, and it has successfully been normalizing both Trump and the creeping totalitarianism of the Democratic Party for years.
Going back a little further, the last time the New York Times opposed any of America’s endless, pointless, and invariably failed criminal “military operations“ and wars in other countries, which have left millions of corpses around the world during the last three-quarters of a century, was in 1983 (Reagan‘s invasion of Grenada). Jimmy Carter said the United States is the most warlike nation in human history. The US population is so thoroughly imbued with the mentality of militarism that it is incapable of recognizing its own militaristic pathology or that of its government. General Mattis, Trump’s Secretary of Defense, said of the notorious Haditha massacre, in which US soldiers murdered 24 Iraqi civilians in cold blood, and went unpunished after years of exhaustive official investigations that conclusively demonstrated the soldiers’ guilt, “you can’t criminalize every mistake.” This is the normal treatment the US military gives to the war crimes it commits. This is the self-serving, conscienceless, Machiavellian military environment of which Milley and Kelly are creatures. It is bizarre and concerning to see the imperial US military— and thus militarism itself—being idealized as they are in this newsletter.
The creeping totalitarianism of America, whether or not it becomes accelerated by the election of Trump, is the boomerang effect of the massive totalitarian evils the US constantly, routinely, and without qualms of conscience, or even awareness, inflicts on other peoples around the world. The fact that the US population is in virtually total denial about this reality does not prevent the boomerang effect from taking place. If you want to realistically resist totalitarianism in the US, you have to recognize that it is caused above all by the creatures of the US national security-state and military-industrial complex. You cannot have both an empire and a democracy.
Let's recap all the important subjects out of Hitler's Playbook which Rogan (acting as a media propaganda leuitenant) was told not to ask... or decided to evade in this softball interview:
2.) Trump's fascist policies and Authoritarian platform... with Trump you get a Fascist Kleptocratic Authoritarian Government, something The United States has never experienced. All checks and balances will be lost. Trump's idea is he will be the Dictator in Chief, and begin with exonerating himself of all his crimes then he will attack all his so-called enemies, critics, and fact checkers who exposed his lies
3.) Media suppression and censorship Fox, Tucker Carlson, Joe Rogan, Glenn Beck, with Dave Ramsey will be some of his prime Media propaganda lieutenants while he weaponizes the govt against all other media
4.).Crony capitalism ....Musk bought his way in as "efficiency" advisor, Peter Thiel bought his way in via JD Vance his primary "Yes" Man. RFK Jr his "health minister." Robert Mercer bought his way in via Steve Bannon. Meet the good 'ol boy's ready to hold America captive in years of backwards policies...they all think they will make America "Great" again. Its a club, and we aint in it.
Joe Rogan >Dana White > Vince McMahon > RFK Jr. > Trump > Elon Musk > Peter Thiel > Robert Mercer > Opus Dei > Leonard Leo > New Apostolic Reformation > Heritage Foundation >JD Vance > Laura Loomer > Paula White > Judge Aileen Cannon.
5.) No accountability for our sacred institutions of law and order. He will let all the Jan 6 insurrectionists free. HE WILL help install Project 2025 playbook with Kevin Roberts Heritage Foundation, help ban books, impose tariffs, give tax breaks to millionaires, celebs, and billionaire's. He will focus on mass deportation, abortion bans nationally, isolationist foreign policy, cozy up to Kim Jong Un, Putin, and XiJinping (he just wants to be the toughest "strong" man Autocrat of them all.
6.) Military posturing... He wants to deploy our military at will against the vote of congress and use his nuclear codes as a threat to be the baddest Autocrat on earth. Its all about him and his image. He doesnt care about us as Americans.
1. Attack, Attack, Attack 2. Deny, Deny, Deny 3. Lie, Lie, Lie.... Trump did his best to avoid all these serious topics and cut Rogan off when he tried to even press slightly. Trump wanted to appear calm here, put a chill face on, because he's almost at the finish line to avoid accountability for his legal woes.
If Trump gets this power back in office he will NOT relinquish it for the rest of his life. After 4-8 years of his family assuming power, installing a regime of Project 2025 loyalists, and his infighting, keleptocracy like Putin, many Americans will realize that voting for this man was the worst mistake in United States History. But sadly like Nazi Germany, many Americans want a government like Nazi Germany, and because of this Trump may win. If Trump wins, the American people have spoken...his voters want to be the New Nazi Germany.
The entire republican party,and "normal" conservatives that have propped up an unfit, unwell, felon,fraud, and rapist have failed the country and the constitution with their cowardice. Better late than never that they sound the alarm now, and we need everyone to fight for democracy. But they do not have my sympathy, and they are far from heroes, and it will take many dedicated years of service to helping to clean up the mess they helped create before they have my trust!
I want to amend a comment I made 16 hours ago in which I was critical of Generals Milley and Kelly for their long silences. But since then I read that General Mark Milley has had bullet-proof windows placed throughout his house. Trump is calling for his court martial and execution. Perhaps General Milley is living in great fear, and probably not only for himself but also for his family members. I also remembered that Mitt Romney said that he has been paying $5,000/DAY for security protection for his family. That is $7,300,000. And it doesn't cover the fear and stress which he and his family must express every day. So I'm withdrawing my judgment of Generals Milley and Kelly. Tragically, the United States is already well underway to being a fascist country.
Thank you, Dr. Lee, for continuing to warn the public against political and mental health shenanigans, even if a photoshoot election outcome, or other close outcome might finally resolve the bruising, "mother of all" election campaigns, through the blindsiding of the public on crucial mental health issues. You and your colleagues, as disinterested professionals, are selflessly, without profit, conscientizing the public both against mainstream mania and wildcard weirdness, thus assisting to fulfill public health's purpose of improving both length of life and quality of life in a potentially bleak situation, solely through seeding minds through truth. Your joint desire to representatively foster the public pursuit of a healthier sociopolitical and socioeconomic climate during the next few years is admirable, even as trumpeting messiah figures pop out of the woodwork at any time, in periods of transfer of power and resources. It is certainly true that much of politics is associated with brand loyalty, disaster, and mail-order diminishing returns. Therefore, a climate of mental health awareness is both welcome and "weilcome" for increasing longevity and quality of life. May Almighty God grant the means to address not only the chink in the armor needs, but the core needs of humankind as well, for which spiritual and mental exercise are no less important than physiological fitness!
Bandy, the decision on the part of 4-Star Generals John Kelly and Mark Milley NOT to go public with their well-founded fears about the dangerousness of Donald Trump, might also reflect how little most of us know regarding how to deal with a volatile, delusional, malevolent sociopath, especially one with the power of the presidency. I wish they'd consulted you directly when they first had serious concerns.
However, it might be helpful, even now, to produce a document with directions similar to those we'd give to someone who has concerns that a family member is "a danger to himself or others." We spoke about creating such a document years ago and I remember researching the laws in D.C. regarding 72hr. holds, and other ideas such as the use of the 25th Amendment.
I'm glad this material has finally been made public but I understand your colleague's disappointment and anger that Milly and Kelly remained silent for so long. I also agree that the restraints the APA exerted over media consulting with mental health experts is one of the real reasons that the gaslighting of America has lasted clear up until only weeks before the election. Thank heaven we've finally reached this tipping point and let's hope it's in the nick of time.
Thank you, Dr Taylor. Great points, in particular the one about not *knowing how to handle troubled, troubling, troublesome personalities. The Generals were navigating in uncharted, extremely turbulent waters. Enough to make almost anyone nervous and reticent.
I think in the course of more typical cases there are ways to intercede or treat people who become disorganized, threatening, violent, etc. You can get restraining orders, you can get them hospitalized, you can call the police, you can work with an HR department to get them fired, you can have a family intervention, etc. NONE of those tools are available for the President of the United States.
I share some exasperation that Kelly and Milley delayed. But they have also both leaked powerful information about Trump, e. g., Kelley let it out about Trump calling dead veterans "losers and" suckers" and I think had even touched on some of the Hitler/German generals material; Milley had been confrontational about the Lafayette Park incident, and he had talked to Woodward for the previous book about Jan 6 and calling his Chinese counterpart to reassure him. These two have been restrained but not silent.
And how long did Woodward wait to publish the information? He did the same thing in the 2020 book where he did not disclose Trump's dishonesty about Covid FOR MONTHS as he would have scooped himself on his own book. How about Woodward's ethics?
Have some perspective. This problem is way beyond Kelly and Milley. They can't convene a meeting to discuss the 25th Amendment. That has to come from the VP. Pence was pressured to bring the cabinet together after Jan 6 but refused to do so. That was the time to do it. Plus the Senate, with McConnell's insidious influence, did not convict Trump. Only 7 Republicans voted to convict. Another major and more pointed failure. He would have been finished and unable to run again.
Blame Kevin McCarthy. Blame Mike Meadows. Blame Fox. Blame Hawley and Cruz. Blame NYT and WSJ. Blame Rona Romney. Blame Steve Bannon. Blame John Roberts. Blame Samuel Alito. Blame Jinny Thomas. Blame Matt Goetz and MTG. Blame the Heritage Foundation. Blame Lindsay Grahame and Tom Cotton. Blame all the gaslighters in the MAGA cult. Blame 75 million Americans who will vote for Fascism in 10 days. There is plenty of blame to go around. Where is George W Bush? Where is Mitt Romney? Paul Ryan? John Boehner?
What Kelly and Milley said lasted one news cycle. It sold some newspapers and some books for Woodward. Today there were 30 more ghastly things Trump did and there will be 30 tomorrow. It's like trying to catch all the raindrops with a teacup.
It's way beyond Kelly and Milley to have stopped it. If 3,000 votes change because of it, well then it helped.
"Where is George W Bush? Where is Mitt Romney? Paul Ryan? John Boehner?" lmportant questions to this erstwhile Republican (i.e., me). Sure wish candidate Trump could have been subject to a Court Martial proceeding as the Commander-in-Chief.
That would have been a nice chess move, Ned! Trump's dishonor towards the military is epic in proportion. I can't understand how any Vet or anyone in their sphere or anyone who respects our military could Vote MAGA. Not to mention the attitude towards police on Jan 6, or, gross worship of criminals/terrrorists convicted in wake of Jan 6. The latter will all get pardoned 1/20/25 if Trumpenstein is installed. It is so unpatriotic and horrible. You couldn't write this as a screenplay -- it would get rejected!! Better as screenplay than history, though...
Instead, he plans to Court Martial the honorable General Milley if, God forbid, he is elected. After that, General Milley's execution will take place. (We know that he will be found guilty. That's how fascism works, after all.)
Harrowing scenario but entirely possible. I don't know what institutional safeguards could prevent it via military tribunal. Or, as we now know, Trump could unilaterally assassinate foes as an official act and face no consequences -- and could pardon the hangman as well. The SCOMAGA, to its eternal shame, has paved the pathway to fascism. SCOMAGA is caught up in Trump contagion, as will be all institutions if Project 2025 becomes the law of the land. My sense is that by February 2025 it will be readily apparent to millions of Trump voters that he "meant what he said". Will they be horrified or jubilant? Dystopia looms...
Military leaders takes an oath to the Constitution, not to candidate Trump. That means they will, hopefully, belay any orders to prevent killings. At that point th would-be Mussolini will suffer the worst possible living end for people like him; that of being a cranky castratus.
"SCOMAGA". Wow! Precisely on target. Re military tribunals: since the orange sadist has already said that he only wants generals like the ones Hitler had, I don't think there will be any problem ordering an execution. And re the maga reaction to the election? Jubilant, at first. Not so much so, once starvation and fear (for those who realize their mistake and are stupid enough to say so aloud) become the coins of the new nation.
And blame Aileen Cannon
Blame Garland. Blame Atlanta DA who botched the easiest case against Trump.
Jan 6 committee was heroic. The witnesses were heroic. Capitol and DC police were heroic. Jack Smith was heroic. Judge Merchan was heroic. Judge in other NY case was heroic. Justices Kagan, Sotomayor, and Jackson were heroic. Dr Lee and associates were heroic. Ruth Ben-Ghiat has been heroic as have been Jason Stanley and Tim Snyder and Lawrence Tribe. Joe Biden and Kamala Harris have been heroic. The crew of Never Trumpers (so many) have been awesomely heroic. Liz Cheney and Adam K. have been absolutely heroic. Let's hope 85 or 90 million American voters, especially groups of 10,000 in 5 or 6 swing states will be heroic.
Otherwise, it's curtains.
Superb comment about where the blame belongs. (Re Mitt Romney, he continues to pay $5,000/day -- as he has since Jan. 6th -- for security for his family and himself. And that doesn't count the terrible psychological stress they have all experienced. I think he did his part when he could. He's been paying a very high price, ever since.)
Thanks :) I agree that Romney is an equivocal figure, heroic at some moments, invisible at others. He stood up in Impeachment #1 for the first count -- but not the second count (improperly refusing to provide documents/records for Congressional oversight subpoena). He was there the 2nd time, too. He spoke out in his book. Certainly, he has paid a price financially and in terms of safety, for himself and his family. I wonder, though, why not come out all the more strongly in that case? What has he to lose at that point? What is the horror that he, his wife, his children, his grandchildren have to live with now? That story could move people. And he voted 90+++ per cent Republican while in the Senate, so what is that about? He has been brave but also way too constrained, in my opinion. I thought his oratory around the impeachments was brilliant and inspired, and should be included in anthologies of great American oratory, and be taught in schools as an example of courage in the face of corruption and tyranny. I wish him the best in his retirement from public life. I hope he does not wind up in a detention center with Generals Milley & Kelly, Joe Biden, Adam Kinzinger, Liz Cheney, Adam Schiff, Nancy Pelosi, Rachel Maddow, Joe & Mika, Bill Maher, Jimmie Kimmel, Mike Pence, Steve Schmidt, Stuart Stevens, Olivia Troye, Ric Wilson, Colin Kapernik (sp),and Taylor Swift, among others. All will be under threat. Madness!!!
"He has been brave but also way too constrained" Agree! "What has he to lose at that point?" For starters, his life? his wife and/or children's and/or grandchildren's lives? I agree, there are easily half a million people in our nation who face imprisonment or death because they dared to speak out. And that doesn't count the millions of "immigrants" (not counting his or his running mate's wives) who will face the same.
Yes, good point. I didn't mean to be flippant about it at all. It is a serious degree of danger for anyone who has spoken out. I believe the Heritage Foundation, et al., has been busy compiling their lists, and that will only accelerate. Did you listen to the podcast "Project 2025 Up Close and Personal"? It is 6 parts, and after the first one I was pretty shaken up, but I need to go back and listen to the rest of them. This touches on what you are alluding to: what could happen if it becomes real? The first one on immigration was terrifying. So the danger for Romney is real. Maybe if he shuts up he can get a pass...Or maybe there will be more Americans (in the right states) who did not fall prey to the contagion, who did not become "pod people" to fend off the horrors of Trump 2.0. Otherwise, the ascension of Vance to the presidency once Trump dies or gets removed by 25th Amendment -- a move that would be led by Vance-- will be assured. And then they will challenge the 22nd Amendment on presidential term limits, which SCOMAGA will give to them, and we will have Vance for....decades? Shudder to think how bad it could get and for how long...
Today's was a great session, Dr Taylor. My take? (Really, hope.) Vice President Harris will win the popular vote by five-to-seven percentage points and well over three hundred votes in the Electoral College. Let us not be discouraged. The trumper tantrums will bring out the base big-time in early voting; are jamming on the polling; and, tries to monopolize call-in shows. The rest of us will remain steadfast and vote candidate Trump not into the White House, but into jail.
From your lips to god's ears, Ned! I appreciate your confidence. 🙏💙
VERY few people can say they've walked in the shoes of Generals Mark Milley or John Kelly.
Really good point. I try to put myself in the other fellow's shoes, but that exercise, while potentially wise, is purely hypothetical and shaped by my experiences and biasses.
Dr.Lee, I thank you wholeheartedly on behalf of my family and this nation for your continued warnings and shining light on the darkness.
As to the reluctance of major players... I have no proof. It seems increasingly likely the fascist/mob playbook has been in full activation against many. I have thought so since Robert Mueller's cryptic answers in front of congress. The Supreme Court Justice forced into retirement. Justice Ruth passing. Dirty McConnell sicker than a dog. His sister in law dead. Epstein and the missing evidence taken by Barr. People scared, compromised and dirty doing their best to protect family or what they have left.
Ultimately trying to protect their dirty kingdoms.
No proof. Just noticing.
It's deep, dark, and dirty. We maybe know 10% of what went on. It will be 50 years before perhaps half is known. So much corruption, malfeasance, obstruction. Primordial slime creatures.
Sounds like the stuff of a movie, and other forms of bread and fracases, not life.
But, tragically, it is life in the United States, 2024.
Thank you. I think it's a study in itself to look into the various reasons why very intelligent, accomplished, and not foolish people in service to this country would still associate themselves in any way with Trump. Evidently, a number of them have eventually discovered their mistake through direct experience. All it takes is a little study of that man's history and character to realize that he is toxic--to say the least. Foolish Trump supporters might rue the day of voting for him, but the consequences of that experience can take the rest of us down with it. "Experience keeps a dear [costly[ school, but a fool will learn in no other." (B. Franklin)
In my banking days in the late 1990s and the turn of the century, I assumed candidate Trump's "amazing" come-back came from laundering kleptocratically soiled soviet money; I was not alone among bankers in N.Y.C.
Milley and Kelly have both been in the military for many, many years. I have to wonder if they have (individually) anti-psychiatric disability mindsets... if they have "Real men don't cry" beliefs... if they believe "Real men handle their own problems in private... never admit they need to go to a 'shrink'." If this is true (and of course I have no such proof), those beliefs would have prevented them - even though they swore oaths to defend the Constitution - from publicly calling on Trump to get psychiatric treatment / possible removal from office using the 25th Amendment. Even if my guess is incorrect, I see their lack of action... and their unwillingness to appear at last month's event at the Washington Press Club ... as evidence they have psychological barriers to seeing the true disease we are dealing with here... evidence they are still not really "part of the solution" to ridding America of Trump Contagion. Just my 2 cents.
While I disagree with contemning Generals Kelly and and Milley as failing to be part of the solution, your thinking about the mind-set may hit the bull's eye. Steve, I suspect your 'thinking-out-writ' is, at least to some extent, accurate. Compounded by the two factors, identified below, an inward deterrent to outward declarations would be formidable, at least for me.
1st, Dr Taylor's thought on lay(wo)men often not knowing how to handle impaired souls; as well as,
2nd, K.D.'s observation about the security measures taken by various public servants to threats from the more vile M.A.G.A.s predisposed toward violence.
Thank you, Doc! 🤝
Boy, have I missed y'all; really psyched for tomorrow's 'Div.-dive' analysis. 🥳
For someone who has nothing to do, my Fridays became jammed. 😯
On the reading, I side with your charity, Dr Lee. 😇
Your friend's article struck me as myopic and lacking empathy. 🤫
Putting me in the place of these two generals, several reasons aside from cowardice come to mind for their silence. 🔍
1st, both Gen. Milley and Gen. Kelly are career soldiers reliant upon a chain-of-command; breaking that chain is hard to do for (wo)men conditioned to it for thirty-plus years. 🪖
2nd, both Generals may have felt it presumptuous to speak out as they are not trained in psychiatry and psychology. 😳
3rd, discretion was the better part of valour, particularly in the case of General Milley; he could trust himself to honour his oath to the Constitution and belay orders, etc. Who knows what other Michael Flynns might be conniving away among the flag officers? 😰
4th, timing is everything, particularly for General Kelly. Had he called out candidate Trump's impairment in 2018, as he had implied to Congress(wo)men already (perhaps in the hope of an intervention by G.O.P. leadership to remove candidate Trump from the ticket in 2020), his revelation would have been old news by 2020 let alone 2024. Coming just prior to this year's election, the statements of these Generals should quiver, if not quite move, the needle. 💡
5th, it is hard to tell how close the country was, and is, to a civil conflict with fighting in the streets. Many militias and violent mal-contents are aligned with candidate Trump. Perhaps, Generals Kelly and Milley felt they were keeping a lid on a simmering cauldron in danger of boiling over into civil war. 🤞
I COMPLETELY agree with the assessment. They have failed in doing their duty to their country. MOreover, and I know I will get flack from this - I feel the same about Hutchinson and company. They all kept quiet, they all enabled him, until it became apparent that crimes were being committed and they could be considered complicit. I am glad they spoke up - but they still enable him in the big lie, and they still got their fat salaries. I admire Liz Cheney and Adam Kizinger.
I share your admiration for former Representatives Cheney and Kinzinger. On the other hand, the pressures of the positions working for an impaired chief executive would be immense. I suspect these aides figured that they could ride out candidate Trump's exit and preserve their careers.
The temptation of temporizing might well have been overwhelming for me; if not so inclined, I would have been fired and on the outside with no credibility to inform others.
Then came 06jan21.
Then there was no longer an enabling way for anyone of conscience to rationalize that event and candidate Trump's role in instigating the insurrection. Also, Ms Hutchinson should not be singled out; she was twenty-five and likely felt she could not affect anything.
Then came the 06jan21 investigating committee.
That gave her and some others the opportunity to speak up and be heard. I commend Ms Hutchinson's maturity and courage at so young an age.
I was thinking about something I read today: General Milley has had bullet-proof windows throughout his house. Trump is calling for his court martial and execution. Perhaps he is living in great fear, and probably not only for himself but also for his family members.
I have heard that Mitt Romney has said this about himself and his family.
Yes, he continues to live in fear -- because he merely stood up and told the truth. Fascism has been alive and well for almost a decade in this country. This election will determine if it will be the hellscape of our future.
Really keen insight there, K.D.; threats to these officials are often implicitly or explicitly extended to their families. Being never-married, I have the option of being fatalistic in the face of such threats. What if I were married and had children, perhaps grand-children, and other loved ones attached to me? Well, endangering them by being 'brave' sure would make me think twice, thrice, seeking advice.
Thanks for your comment, Ned. As I read what you wrote, I found myself thinking about Mitt Romney. Since January 6, 2021, he has paid $5,000 PER DAY for security guards to protect him and his family. That's a WHOPPING $7,300,00 -- and it doesn't count the constant emotional stress he and his family members are under.
Thank you for your 'granular' compassion, K.D. Very sobering, indeed.
(Do you mean "looking at each situation individually"?)
No. I mean mixing data and concepts in a balanced manner that keep intact the focus on the larger issues and on factual credibility.
The professional Ego is the end of us. I call it the Night of Humanity, by which I don't mean the end of the species, but the depths we must go for truth and a love for truth.
The APA‘s invocation of the Goldwater rule would have been moot and ineffectual if it had not been rigorously enforced by the New York Times, which sets the agenda for the mainstream press. The New York Times is a major, essential instrument of the plutocracy, political oligarchy, and national security-state military-industrial complex, and it has successfully been normalizing both Trump and the creeping totalitarianism of the Democratic Party for years.
Going back a little further, the last time the New York Times opposed any of America’s endless, pointless, and invariably failed criminal “military operations“ and wars in other countries, which have left millions of corpses around the world during the last three-quarters of a century, was in 1983 (Reagan‘s invasion of Grenada). Jimmy Carter said the United States is the most warlike nation in human history. The US population is so thoroughly imbued with the mentality of militarism that it is incapable of recognizing its own militaristic pathology or that of its government. General Mattis, Trump’s Secretary of Defense, said of the notorious Haditha massacre, in which US soldiers murdered 24 Iraqi civilians in cold blood, and went unpunished after years of exhaustive official investigations that conclusively demonstrated the soldiers’ guilt, “you can’t criminalize every mistake.” This is the normal treatment the US military gives to the war crimes it commits. This is the self-serving, conscienceless, Machiavellian military environment of which Milley and Kelly are creatures. It is bizarre and concerning to see the imperial US military— and thus militarism itself—being idealized as they are in this newsletter.
The creeping totalitarianism of America, whether or not it becomes accelerated by the election of Trump, is the boomerang effect of the massive totalitarian evils the US constantly, routinely, and without qualms of conscience, or even awareness, inflicts on other peoples around the world. The fact that the US population is in virtually total denial about this reality does not prevent the boomerang effect from taking place. If you want to realistically resist totalitarianism in the US, you have to recognize that it is caused above all by the creatures of the US national security-state and military-industrial complex. You cannot have both an empire and a democracy.
Sometimes I wonder if were being seduced by power at the expense of our democracy like Japan in the 1930s.
Let's recap all the important subjects out of Hitler's Playbook which Rogan (acting as a media propaganda leuitenant) was told not to ask... or decided to evade in this softball interview:
1.) Trump's mental health http://dutytoinform.org malignant narcissism https://worldmhc.org/ psychopathy http://psychopac.org
2.) Trump's fascist policies and Authoritarian platform... with Trump you get a Fascist Kleptocratic Authoritarian Government, something The United States has never experienced. All checks and balances will be lost. Trump's idea is he will be the Dictator in Chief, and begin with exonerating himself of all his crimes then he will attack all his so-called enemies, critics, and fact checkers who exposed his lies
3.) Media suppression and censorship Fox, Tucker Carlson, Joe Rogan, Glenn Beck, with Dave Ramsey will be some of his prime Media propaganda lieutenants while he weaponizes the govt against all other media
4.).Crony capitalism ....Musk bought his way in as "efficiency" advisor, Peter Thiel bought his way in via JD Vance his primary "Yes" Man. RFK Jr his "health minister." Robert Mercer bought his way in via Steve Bannon. Meet the good 'ol boy's ready to hold America captive in years of backwards policies...they all think they will make America "Great" again. Its a club, and we aint in it.
Joe Rogan >Dana White > Vince McMahon > RFK Jr. > Trump > Elon Musk > Peter Thiel > Robert Mercer > Opus Dei > Leonard Leo > New Apostolic Reformation > Heritage Foundation >JD Vance > Laura Loomer > Paula White > Judge Aileen Cannon.
5.) No accountability for our sacred institutions of law and order. He will let all the Jan 6 insurrectionists free. HE WILL help install Project 2025 playbook with Kevin Roberts Heritage Foundation, help ban books, impose tariffs, give tax breaks to millionaires, celebs, and billionaire's. He will focus on mass deportation, abortion bans nationally, isolationist foreign policy, cozy up to Kim Jong Un, Putin, and XiJinping (he just wants to be the toughest "strong" man Autocrat of them all.
6.) Military posturing... He wants to deploy our military at will against the vote of congress and use his nuclear codes as a threat to be the baddest Autocrat on earth. Its all about him and his image. He doesnt care about us as Americans.
1. Attack, Attack, Attack 2. Deny, Deny, Deny 3. Lie, Lie, Lie.... Trump did his best to avoid all these serious topics and cut Rogan off when he tried to even press slightly. Trump wanted to appear calm here, put a chill face on, because he's almost at the finish line to avoid accountability for his legal woes.
If Trump gets this power back in office he will NOT relinquish it for the rest of his life. After 4-8 years of his family assuming power, installing a regime of Project 2025 loyalists, and his infighting, keleptocracy like Putin, many Americans will realize that voting for this man was the worst mistake in United States History. But sadly like Nazi Germany, many Americans want a government like Nazi Germany, and because of this Trump may win. If Trump wins, the American people have spoken...his voters want to be the New Nazi Germany.
The entire republican party,and "normal" conservatives that have propped up an unfit, unwell, felon,fraud, and rapist have failed the country and the constitution with their cowardice. Better late than never that they sound the alarm now, and we need everyone to fight for democracy. But they do not have my sympathy, and they are far from heroes, and it will take many dedicated years of service to helping to clean up the mess they helped create before they have my trust!
I want to amend a comment I made 16 hours ago in which I was critical of Generals Milley and Kelly for their long silences. But since then I read that General Mark Milley has had bullet-proof windows placed throughout his house. Trump is calling for his court martial and execution. Perhaps General Milley is living in great fear, and probably not only for himself but also for his family members. I also remembered that Mitt Romney said that he has been paying $5,000/DAY for security protection for his family. That is $7,300,000. And it doesn't cover the fear and stress which he and his family must express every day. So I'm withdrawing my judgment of Generals Milley and Kelly. Tragically, the United States is already well underway to being a fascist country.
Thank you, Dr. Lee, for continuing to warn the public against political and mental health shenanigans, even if a photoshoot election outcome, or other close outcome might finally resolve the bruising, "mother of all" election campaigns, through the blindsiding of the public on crucial mental health issues. You and your colleagues, as disinterested professionals, are selflessly, without profit, conscientizing the public both against mainstream mania and wildcard weirdness, thus assisting to fulfill public health's purpose of improving both length of life and quality of life in a potentially bleak situation, solely through seeding minds through truth. Your joint desire to representatively foster the public pursuit of a healthier sociopolitical and socioeconomic climate during the next few years is admirable, even as trumpeting messiah figures pop out of the woodwork at any time, in periods of transfer of power and resources. It is certainly true that much of politics is associated with brand loyalty, disaster, and mail-order diminishing returns. Therefore, a climate of mental health awareness is both welcome and "weilcome" for increasing longevity and quality of life. May Almighty God grant the means to address not only the chink in the armor needs, but the core needs of humankind as well, for which spiritual and mental exercise are no less important than physiological fitness!
That might be "photo finish...outcome..."
That should be "both welcome and 'wealcome'..."
Thank you for this fitting tribute, John. Your discernible humility and sincerity add an extra punch of credibility to your thinking.
Thank you for the encouragement, Ned. Likewise!