I agree with Abraham Lincoln’s idea that public sentiment is everything. “With it, nothing can fail; against it, nothing can succeed. Whoever molds public sentiment goes deeper than he who enacts statutes or pronounces judicial decisions.”
How is public sentiment molded? When two people with a direct personal relationship reflexively respond to their conflicting conclusions by initiating an adult conversation in which they work together to resolve the conflict, they are molding public sentiment. A person who reflexively responds by implying “I’m right, you’re wrong, and this conversation is over” is eroding public sentiment.
Trump is a symptom of the “eroded public sentiment” disease. There’s little any of us can do about that, but that little thing might make all the difference. We can make sure we are molding, and otherwise make sure we are not eroding, public sentiment in our direct personal relationships.
If society depends solely on public sentiment in direct personal relationships, then why do we need religions, politics, science, capitalism, justice, etc.? Because when people are molding public sentiment in their direct personal relationships, religions, politics, science, capitalism, justice, and other moral traditions emerge. Then, those traditions are being served, and the traditions are serving the human social system, to the extent that people are molding public sentiment in their direct personal relationships.
A building is an analogy for our global social system. The building has parts made of bricks held together with mortar including a foundation, different rooms, and a roof. The building’s parts are held together with mortar. The human social system’s parts include different moral traditions. Those traditions and the system are held together if public sentiment is being molded in direct personal relationships within and between those traditions.
Dr. Lee can’t force the A.P.I. to listen to her just because she wants to challenge their logic, but I can make sure I listen to people who, like you, challenge my logic. And if you return the favor, then we are molding one tiny part of public sentiment. It can feel insignificant, but so does voting, and both are significant. Indra’s net comes to mind.
I read your reply very attentively but I'm not sure you had read the excellent Dr. Bandy X. Lee's newsletter thus.
Namely, the antisocial ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies can NOT be, objectively and subjectively concluded, a part of all of that good that you have written. How come you don't seem to understand that much? Please, re-read the excellent Dr. Bandy X. Lee's newsletter!!
All the best!!
p.s. "A.P.I."? an acronym for what, not sure. Did you mean APA i.e. American Psychiatric Association or I'm missing something?
Thank you for attentively reading my comment. I have also tried to attentively read your reply.
If you’re saying Dr. Lee and I have drawn conflicting conclusions, then I agree. That means there is at least one flaw in at least one person’s logic. The way to discover that flaw is to openly share and challenge each others’ logic. For example, just because someone assumes that not every conflict between humans is resolvable does not mean that the assumption is not testable.
If you’re saying I should not be expressing a conflicting conclusion or I should not be challenging Dr. Lee’s logic, then I strongly disagree. Dr. Lee and I are scientists. When scientists draw conflicting conclusions, they resolve the conflict by identifying each others’ logic flaws by openly sharing and challenging each others’ logic.
If I’m doing something wrong, then I’m expecting that you will identify a flaw in my logic, but that’s not what I found in your reply, unless you’re saying I’m wrong to challenge Dr. Lee’s logic, and then I again disagree. That would imply that I shouldn’t be doing science. Science involves challenging the logic in the assumptions we use to interpret the evidence we observe because they will otherwise distort how we interpret our observations. That is more than just part of science. It is literally the first principle of science.
Sir, please spare me of your verbosity and your self-serving platitudes. Resolve that with psychologists and psychiatrists how and why you choose to ramble about science offtopic when faced with a simple empirical existential issue of the authoritarian ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies being antisocial.
In the following, I’ll do my best to limit my verbosity:
Ad hominem: a rhetorical strategy where the speaker attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself.
So glad King Bellicose the First . . . erm . . . the Worst got a come-uppance. That sneering gratification is likely to be short-lived. The failure of the charade-parade may provoke the crown-seeking clown even more. Buckle up, lassies and laddies!
What I resent, really detest, however, is how the rogue tyrant out of control dishonoured the great majority of our brothers and sisters in uniform -- past and present -- with politicisation of one of their professionalism and oaths to the Constitution.
I have erased my original comment. I should know better than to call any human being -- no matter how much I dislike, even detest, him or her -- sub-human. My apologies.
The American National Parks people say more like 11 million and they are experts at estimating crowds. Think of all the little towns and assisted living protests across our country❤️
I have an expression I use, a personal mantra of sorts that Dr. Lee came close to using as well herein: "I aim to be a healthy cell in a cancerous body politic." Knowing how to do that, and dedicating myself to the task, is a daily practice...
Isn't it time to specify the resistance? We have been treated to the danger ad nauseum. Must we merely grope towards the light, with what is in our hearts, or can we organize with our minds, our hands and feet? The erstwhile survivors/refugees from political persecution and state violence know how to draw lines. What lessons must we learn?
“We’ve been treated to the danger ad nauseam” because *we* are the same people who stay informed, through the same media channels, vote the same way, protest, etc. In the same space are those who consume Fox, or no news at all, vote the same way (the other way), did not protest. There are still 40-45% who approve of Trump, not including those who manage to not have an opinion.
Those people do not see or understand the dangers. People are so polarised that we live in separate bubbles and my fear is that we repeat the same blind optimism as in November. There is no effective resistance possible until we manage to reach those in the other bubble; it will be a succession of great rallies and marches but we will keep failing at the polls.
I’m also really worried about the growing number of election deniers on our side who are so focused on shouting Trump lost the election and confusing a pile of circumstantial information with hard proof, they don’t bother to draw lessons from 2024 and don’t prepare for 2026.
Excuse me ma'm, you have issues that only you yourself can solve.
1. your overly desperate co-dependence on and craving for the tRumputinists to become the way you want them. You might want to rethink your "strategy" in favor of breaking free away from that co-dependence. Think deep how to be authentic yourself ANTItRumputinist American and push self-defensively and proudly for your life, rights and interest, is my advice to you.
2. You are worried of the ugly facts that tRumputinists have, simply, purged at least ca. 4 million Democratic voters from the voting rolls prior to the nov. 5th 2024 election; of the never-before experienced at this magnitude "drop-off" effects in the battleground states, which occurred on nov. 5th 2024; of the terrorist putin's gru bombing threats to Democratic places on nov. 5th 2024 etc.... get revealed and acknowledged in the American public?? Weird.
Well I think we got a fairly confidence-building taste of resistance this w / e. The M.A.G.A. types now know that guttural noises about civil war will no longer work.
If you want to make a point or engage in a conversation, you will have to get rid of the patronising attitude, start reading properly and provide reliable sources to back up your claim.
I ought to've added that I'm looking for ways to assist others in being that, too: as my service. To bridge the political with the mindful, heart-centered, justice craving pathways... that keep us sane, that help us restore faith, that help us brave the scary divides...
Americans of divided i.e. contrasted worldviews should be able to agree that they'll never agree yet be always mindful and respectful of the rule - do not do unto others what you would not want the others do unto you!! That is - no opposing team will ever rule the lives, rights and interests of the other opposing team!!
This also should apply to every country and society in the world!!
BUT, the authoritarian ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies know this and precisely hate this. they don't want to have it any other way but explicitly sadistically having us the others strangled to death by them. therein IS the problem!!
In essence, the phrase "something is rotten in the state of Denmark" is a metaphor for a situation where there is widespread moral decay, corruption, or a deep sense of something being wrong and amiss. You can guarantee the Bard will find the correct metaphor for the situation.
Thank you, Dr. Lee. Indeed, fascism goes hand in hand with faceism, such as shows of military might. Peace will always steadily overcome aggression, and rationality will eventually prevail over irrationality.
I really appreciate this comment. My understanding of psychology is that we're too easily mired in either someone else's deteriorating and threatening reality or in opposition to it. We need to stop going through the same loop, by connecting the deeper reality of our aspirations to a viable future that lifts our energy level. Those trapped on the other side are increasingly looking for a better way, a positive future to replace the bleak thing they believe they're condemned to live. We are in a better position to provide that than those caught in the pathological spiral of MAGA. I believe this is a struggle for many of us, and the very nature of an uncertain future is that we make it ourselves, which is the reason for connecting with each other, sharing the love and solidarity, the intelligence that builds a viable future that gives us energy. We are not without emotional resources, and should not wallow in discouragement. I think it's time to start. I've been waiting for this moment to see the tide changing. Let's go.
I think we could see that cowards work best in a herd, and that MAGA -- wherever it was (not seen?) -- is a lot of careless motor-mouths, the likes of Kristi Noem and Pete Hegseth.
Civil behavior and deserved push-back will hopefully awaken more to the stakes, and to the experience of so many Angelenos who are here as refugees from oppressive police work, still working to keep their communities safe from lawless police, while contributing selflessly to our betterment, raising strong families.
Again, thank you for your timely analysis of what we're facing. I do believe this contagion has metastasized to the point of needing both surgery and chemotherapy.....the question for us to answer is: what comes first, the surgery or the chemo and what surgical protocol and chemical concoction will eradicate this vile disease..... I wish I had the expertise to lend to this curative procedure, I can only give my full support to the expert direction of professionals like you Dr. Lee. So please consider what our plans should be going forward, how to avoid the pitfalls that undoubtedly will arise, and what the real prognosis might be..... can we recover with such steep hurdles??? Many thanks again for staying the course and not abandoning us. Peace 🙏💙🕊️
So would surgery be invasive like a civil war? Would chemo-therapy be medieval blood-letting and conducting mass arrests? We all want a great leap forward but people need to start spit-balling. The protests were a great start.
For as long as tRumputinists see that NONtRumputinist Americans are immediately freaked out by a mere thought of a possible civil war, the tRumputinists will be, I'm afraid, ruling in this psychological warfare.
Of course that civil war is to be avoided and would've been a horrible, worst thing, but you don't want to be paralyzed by a mere possibility of it, but self-defensively ready for it because tRumputinists have been terrorizing you/us with that evil threat and blackmail anyways and no matter what for a decade already, my friend!!
Would you please more clearly say what exactly do you mean by that reply? I’m hoping you understand that Ukraine is literally defending the Modern West while fighting off the terrorist putin’s of russia genocide and fighting for its i.e. Ukraine’s and Modern West’s existence and democracy!!
Agreed 111%. I did not want to go too far off-topic. I agree insofar as people need to quit being intimidated by bullies.
After the drone attack by Ukraine wiping out a third of Russia's strategic bombers and the demonstration of the superiority not only of N.A.T.O. warfare technology in a dog-fight that wasn't (i.e., a premier Russian jet blown away in seconds without ever knowing what hit the pilot who, fortunately, ejected and survived) but also Ukraine's mastery of it, Putin's nuclear sabre-rattling is as empty as his atrophied soul and Trump's vacuous character.
I'd only say it's/would be fortunate (your word) that the terrorist putin's pilot survived - with the condition he cathartically changes for better, opens his eyes as to what monster his leader is, finds his conscience and becomes a pro-Ukrainian pro-Democracy oriented Russian oppositionary to the regime, precisely in the spirit of people needing to quit being intimidated by the bullies i.e. terrorist putin of russia-his regime-system!! Otherwise, nope!!
You have such insightful information about the psychological madness in Donald Trumps mind. I don’t have any $ on me now, but I definitely want to hear your thoughts and opinions.
I agree with Abraham Lincoln’s idea that public sentiment is everything. “With it, nothing can fail; against it, nothing can succeed. Whoever molds public sentiment goes deeper than he who enacts statutes or pronounces judicial decisions.”
How is public sentiment molded? When two people with a direct personal relationship reflexively respond to their conflicting conclusions by initiating an adult conversation in which they work together to resolve the conflict, they are molding public sentiment. A person who reflexively responds by implying “I’m right, you’re wrong, and this conversation is over” is eroding public sentiment.
Trump is a symptom of the “eroded public sentiment” disease. There’s little any of us can do about that, but that little thing might make all the difference. We can make sure we are molding, and otherwise make sure we are not eroding, public sentiment in our direct personal relationships.
But if the malignant "normalcy" is established, how and why to depend solely on "public sentiment" in a such a society??
I hope my answer is as good as your question.
If society depends solely on public sentiment in direct personal relationships, then why do we need religions, politics, science, capitalism, justice, etc.? Because when people are molding public sentiment in their direct personal relationships, religions, politics, science, capitalism, justice, and other moral traditions emerge. Then, those traditions are being served, and the traditions are serving the human social system, to the extent that people are molding public sentiment in their direct personal relationships.
A building is an analogy for our global social system. The building has parts made of bricks held together with mortar including a foundation, different rooms, and a roof. The building’s parts are held together with mortar. The human social system’s parts include different moral traditions. Those traditions and the system are held together if public sentiment is being molded in direct personal relationships within and between those traditions.
Dr. Lee can’t force the A.P.I. to listen to her just because she wants to challenge their logic, but I can make sure I listen to people who, like you, challenge my logic. And if you return the favor, then we are molding one tiny part of public sentiment. It can feel insignificant, but so does voting, and both are significant. Indra’s net comes to mind.
I read your reply very attentively but I'm not sure you had read the excellent Dr. Bandy X. Lee's newsletter thus.
Namely, the antisocial ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies can NOT be, objectively and subjectively concluded, a part of all of that good that you have written. How come you don't seem to understand that much? Please, re-read the excellent Dr. Bandy X. Lee's newsletter!!
All the best!!
p.s. "A.P.I."? an acronym for what, not sure. Did you mean APA i.e. American Psychiatric Association or I'm missing something?
Yes, I meant APA. My mistake.
Thank you for attentively reading my comment. I have also tried to attentively read your reply.
If you’re saying Dr. Lee and I have drawn conflicting conclusions, then I agree. That means there is at least one flaw in at least one person’s logic. The way to discover that flaw is to openly share and challenge each others’ logic. For example, just because someone assumes that not every conflict between humans is resolvable does not mean that the assumption is not testable.
If you’re saying I should not be expressing a conflicting conclusion or I should not be challenging Dr. Lee’s logic, then I strongly disagree. Dr. Lee and I are scientists. When scientists draw conflicting conclusions, they resolve the conflict by identifying each others’ logic flaws by openly sharing and challenging each others’ logic.
If I’m doing something wrong, then I’m expecting that you will identify a flaw in my logic, but that’s not what I found in your reply, unless you’re saying I’m wrong to challenge Dr. Lee’s logic, and then I again disagree. That would imply that I shouldn’t be doing science. Science involves challenging the logic in the assumptions we use to interpret the evidence we observe because they will otherwise distort how we interpret our observations. That is more than just part of science. It is literally the first principle of science.
Sir, please spare me of your verbosity and your self-serving platitudes. Resolve that with psychologists and psychiatrists how and why you choose to ramble about science offtopic when faced with a simple empirical existential issue of the authoritarian ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies being antisocial.
have a good day.
In the following, I’ll do my best to limit my verbosity:
Ad hominem: a rhetorical strategy where the speaker attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself.
So glad King Bellicose the First . . . erm . . . the Worst got a come-uppance. That sneering gratification is likely to be short-lived. The failure of the charade-parade may provoke the crown-seeking clown even more. Buckle up, lassies and laddies!
What I resent, really detest, however, is how the rogue tyrant out of control dishonoured the great majority of our brothers and sisters in uniform -- past and present -- with politicisation of one of their professionalism and oaths to the Constitution.
"Trumpanzee"--love that!
I have erased my original comment. I should know better than to call any human being -- no matter how much I dislike, even detest, him or her -- sub-human. My apologies.
The American National Parks people say more like 11 million and they are experts at estimating crowds. Think of all the little towns and assisted living protests across our country❤️
I have an expression I use, a personal mantra of sorts that Dr. Lee came close to using as well herein: "I aim to be a healthy cell in a cancerous body politic." Knowing how to do that, and dedicating myself to the task, is a daily practice...
Isn't it time to specify the resistance? We have been treated to the danger ad nauseum. Must we merely grope towards the light, with what is in our hearts, or can we organize with our minds, our hands and feet? The erstwhile survivors/refugees from political persecution and state violence know how to draw lines. What lessons must we learn?
“We’ve been treated to the danger ad nauseam” because *we* are the same people who stay informed, through the same media channels, vote the same way, protest, etc. In the same space are those who consume Fox, or no news at all, vote the same way (the other way), did not protest. There are still 40-45% who approve of Trump, not including those who manage to not have an opinion.
Those people do not see or understand the dangers. People are so polarised that we live in separate bubbles and my fear is that we repeat the same blind optimism as in November. There is no effective resistance possible until we manage to reach those in the other bubble; it will be a succession of great rallies and marches but we will keep failing at the polls.
I’m also really worried about the growing number of election deniers on our side who are so focused on shouting Trump lost the election and confusing a pile of circumstantial information with hard proof, they don’t bother to draw lessons from 2024 and don’t prepare for 2026.
Excuse me ma'm, you have issues that only you yourself can solve.
1. your overly desperate co-dependence on and craving for the tRumputinists to become the way you want them. You might want to rethink your "strategy" in favor of breaking free away from that co-dependence. Think deep how to be authentic yourself ANTItRumputinist American and push self-defensively and proudly for your life, rights and interest, is my advice to you.
2. You are worried of the ugly facts that tRumputinists have, simply, purged at least ca. 4 million Democratic voters from the voting rolls prior to the nov. 5th 2024 election; of the never-before experienced at this magnitude "drop-off" effects in the battleground states, which occurred on nov. 5th 2024; of the terrorist putin's gru bombing threats to Democratic places on nov. 5th 2024 etc.... get revealed and acknowledged in the American public?? Weird.
Well I think we got a fairly confidence-building taste of resistance this w / e. The M.A.G.A. types now know that guttural noises about civil war will no longer work.
If you want to make a point or engage in a conversation, you will have to get rid of the patronising attitude, start reading properly and provide reliable sources to back up your claim.
As usual you nailed it ! If only we could get more attention!
very well written, strong. Keep up the great work. no burn out--get some breaks in there.
I ought to've added that I'm looking for ways to assist others in being that, too: as my service. To bridge the political with the mindful, heart-centered, justice craving pathways... that keep us sane, that help us restore faith, that help us brave the scary divides...
Now, that is a positive suggestion on what to do. This civil conflict may be won more at the dinner table than on battle fields. Thank you, Marcia.
Americans of divided i.e. contrasted worldviews should be able to agree that they'll never agree yet be always mindful and respectful of the rule - do not do unto others what you would not want the others do unto you!! That is - no opposing team will ever rule the lives, rights and interests of the other opposing team!!
This also should apply to every country and society in the world!!
BUT, the authoritarian ideologies and practices such as neo-nazi-fascism-stalinism-oligarchies know this and precisely hate this. they don't want to have it any other way but explicitly sadistically having us the others strangled to death by them. therein IS the problem!!
“Something is rotten in the state of Denmark”
In essence, the phrase "something is rotten in the state of Denmark" is a metaphor for a situation where there is widespread moral decay, corruption, or a deep sense of something being wrong and amiss. You can guarantee the Bard will find the correct metaphor for the situation.
Correct. And it would be helpful to put the blame where it belongs - tRumputinists.
Thank you, Dr. Lee. Indeed, fascism goes hand in hand with faceism, such as shows of military might. Peace will always steadily overcome aggression, and rationality will eventually prevail over irrationality.
I really appreciate this comment. My understanding of psychology is that we're too easily mired in either someone else's deteriorating and threatening reality or in opposition to it. We need to stop going through the same loop, by connecting the deeper reality of our aspirations to a viable future that lifts our energy level. Those trapped on the other side are increasingly looking for a better way, a positive future to replace the bleak thing they believe they're condemned to live. We are in a better position to provide that than those caught in the pathological spiral of MAGA. I believe this is a struggle for many of us, and the very nature of an uncertain future is that we make it ourselves, which is the reason for connecting with each other, sharing the love and solidarity, the intelligence that builds a viable future that gives us energy. We are not without emotional resources, and should not wallow in discouragement. I think it's time to start. I've been waiting for this moment to see the tide changing. Let's go.
I think we could see that cowards work best in a herd, and that MAGA -- wherever it was (not seen?) -- is a lot of careless motor-mouths, the likes of Kristi Noem and Pete Hegseth.
Civil behavior and deserved push-back will hopefully awaken more to the stakes, and to the experience of so many Angelenos who are here as refugees from oppressive police work, still working to keep their communities safe from lawless police, while contributing selflessly to our betterment, raising strong families.
Again, thank you for your timely analysis of what we're facing. I do believe this contagion has metastasized to the point of needing both surgery and chemotherapy.....the question for us to answer is: what comes first, the surgery or the chemo and what surgical protocol and chemical concoction will eradicate this vile disease..... I wish I had the expertise to lend to this curative procedure, I can only give my full support to the expert direction of professionals like you Dr. Lee. So please consider what our plans should be going forward, how to avoid the pitfalls that undoubtedly will arise, and what the real prognosis might be..... can we recover with such steep hurdles??? Many thanks again for staying the course and not abandoning us. Peace 🙏💙🕊️
So would surgery be invasive like a civil war? Would chemo-therapy be medieval blood-letting and conducting mass arrests? We all want a great leap forward but people need to start spit-balling. The protests were a great start.
For as long as tRumputinists see that NONtRumputinist Americans are immediately freaked out by a mere thought of a possible civil war, the tRumputinists will be, I'm afraid, ruling in this psychological warfare.
Of course that civil war is to be avoided and would've been a horrible, worst thing, but you don't want to be paralyzed by a mere possibility of it, but self-defensively ready for it because tRumputinists have been terrorizing you/us with that evil threat and blackmail anyways and no matter what for a decade already, my friend!!
Holds very true for the 'we' of the WEst with respect to Ukraine.
Would you please more clearly say what exactly do you mean by that reply? I’m hoping you understand that Ukraine is literally defending the Modern West while fighting off the terrorist putin’s of russia genocide and fighting for its i.e. Ukraine’s and Modern West’s existence and democracy!!
Agreed 111%. I did not want to go too far off-topic. I agree insofar as people need to quit being intimidated by bullies.
After the drone attack by Ukraine wiping out a third of Russia's strategic bombers and the demonstration of the superiority not only of N.A.T.O. warfare technology in a dog-fight that wasn't (i.e., a premier Russian jet blown away in seconds without ever knowing what hit the pilot who, fortunately, ejected and survived) but also Ukraine's mastery of it, Putin's nuclear sabre-rattling is as empty as his atrophied soul and Trump's vacuous character.
I'd only say it's/would be fortunate (your word) that the terrorist putin's pilot survived - with the condition he cathartically changes for better, opens his eyes as to what monster his leader is, finds his conscience and becomes a pro-Ukrainian pro-Democracy oriented Russian oppositionary to the regime, precisely in the spirit of people needing to quit being intimidated by the bullies i.e. terrorist putin of russia-his regime-system!! Otherwise, nope!!
💙💙💙
You have such insightful information about the psychological madness in Donald Trumps mind. I don’t have any $ on me now, but I definitely want to hear your thoughts and opinions.
Thank you for teaching me.
It is so frustrating that even politicians who are most open to mental health experts,
like Jamie Raskin, still rattle off known information and act like they're doing something.